Read this article in:
14 June, 2001The IMF should investigate the behaviour of the multinational companies worldwide and publish the results in a yearly white paper, suggests Giorgio Caprioli, the general secretary of the FIM, one of three IMF affiliates in Italy.
BY STIG JUTTERSTRÖM
The spring sun is shining from a blue sky on the huge balcony outside Giorgio Caprioli's office. It is situated on the top floor of the building belonging to the Italian metalworkers' unions, at Corso Trieste in the northeastern part of Rome, with a wonderful view over the eternal city. Caprioli is the leader of the second biggest one. With its Christian (Catholic) history, culture and traditions, it is natural that its headquarters is at the top, closest to heaven.
Caprioli has an academic background with a degree in political science, specialised in economics and sociology. He says that early on he had a dream to work with the trade unions and in 1978 one of the three confederations in Italy, the CISL (Confederazione Italiana Sindicati Lavoratori, the Italian Confederation of Workers' Trade Unions), was looking for an expert in training in his native town of Bergamo. Caprioli became that expert and his dream was realised. After four years, he moved to Milan, the regional centre of Lombardy and Italy's second biggest city, and to the metalworkers' union FIM, an affiliate of the CISL. Ten years later, in 1992, he became a secretary at the FIM headquarters in Rome, responsible for the steel industry, organising issues, bargaining and work organisation.
Since 1998, Giorgio Caprioli is the general secretary of the FIM. He also represents the three Italian metalworkers' federations on the IMF's Executive Committee.
The Italian trade union movement is divided into three confederations, and the metalworkers' unions as well (see the fact box below). Several attempts have been made to unify them but without success. 1969 marked the beginning of the first structural attempt at unification. In 1972, these efforts led to the foundation of the Unitarian CGIL, CISL and UIL Federation, a transitional compromise solution that hopefully should have been followed, in a second stage, by full organic integration. However, this second stage never materialised.
SITTING IN THE SAME BUILDING
Q: The three unions are already sitting in the same building. When do you think the next attempt will be made to unify them?
A: At the present time, it is difficult to forecast another date for a possible unification. There are different reasons. The first is what kind of connections the unions have with politics. The CGIL has chosen to have a main connection with the parties on the left, a model which is typical also for the Nordic countries. Left means the Democratic Left (Democratici di Sinistra, the former Communist Party). It is not an institutional connection but more a political, psychological and cultural one. The CISL, to which the FIM is affiliated, has by tradition the idea that the union has a great and deep autonomy to the government and the political parties. We have a lot of opinions within the union, and it is the same for the UIL. Another reason is regarding the content of union actions, especially in bargaining. The CISL thinks it is necessary to give more power at local level. Italy is a country with big differences between the regions and between enterprises. Decentralised bargaining is more able to keep the specifics of the local situation. The CGIL is more in favour of centralised bargaining A third reason is how the unions react to the changes in the economy and in the society. The FIM thinks that the task of the union is to bargain to influence the direction in which the changes are going. The FIOM has more the idea to organise resistance against the changes.
NATIONAL AGREEMENTS ARE IMPERATIVE
Q: Do you mean that they are more conservative than your union?
A: In some way, yes. It's a paradox. Thinking by tradition, being to the left is to be more innovative, but it's not the case in Italy. We have some people to the left who are not innovative. If you are conservative or progressive depends on the way the union faces changes in the society.
Q: How important is it for the trade unions to resist employers' attempts to dismantle the national collective agreements?
A: Very important. Although the FIM believes that we have to give more power to decentralised bargaining, we think that national agreements are imperative. We want to maintain them. The national agreement is the tool that guarantees all workers a minimum of rights. It is especially important for the workers in small enterprises which have only the national bargaining. It's a sort of solidarity.
Q: Where are Italian trade unions the strongest, at local or central level?
A: It's an equilibrium between the centre and the periphery, but a great majority of the activists are in the workplaces -- 10,000 of our 190,000 members. We have 350 fulltime officials. Twenty-five are here in the headquarters; all the others are in the regions or at the local level. It is about the same in the other unions.
INCREASED VISIBILITY ON THE POLITICAL STAGE
Q: The trade unions in Europe are in decline, according to a new report from the European Trade Union Institute, based in Brussels, Belgium. In Italy, the proportion of the workforce in trade unions has decreased, from 49 per cent in 1980 to 38 per cent today. How do you explain this?
A: There are three reasons. Firstly, it was the price we had to pay for the policy of responsibility. The unions made an agreement with the government concerning pension and wage increases that was not popular. Secondly, the number of workers has decreased in the big companies such as in the steel and car industry, where the unions usually have been strong, and increased in the small business enterprises, where it is difficult to organise. Thirdly, we have our traditional difficulty to organise what is now an increasing number of white-collar workers and technicians. Here, we have a common problem with the other unions in Europe.
Q: The same report says that the unions have increased their role of visibility on the political stage. Especially after 1996, when the centre-left Prodi government took office, the trade unions have indubitably increased their influence. "But," says the report, "this greater political influence has raised new problems, above all in relations with the rank and file."
A: Yes, this is one of the negative consequences of having too much centralisation. In the last 10 years this centralisation was necessary in order to heal the country's economy. The unions made some important general agreements about the economy to fight against inflation. But today, the healing of the economy has been realised and we need to give more power to the rank and file.
Q: In an interview given to the Italian newspaper La Republica, the American economist and Nobel Prize winner Paul Samuelson has praised the Italian trade unions for their role in the modernisation of the society. "For years you (Italy) have been walking along a razor's edge, and the unions could have given you the fatal push. They didn't do so. Perhaps you don't realise it, but the unions are the jewel in your crown."
A: I agree with Paul Samuelson (big laugh). Otherwise we would have had an economic catastrophe.
NO BARGAINING, NO UNION
Q: You have raised the issue of benchmarking the transnational companies (TNCs) within the International Metalworkers' Federation. How would you like to realise this idea?
A: The fundamental proposal is that the trade union must be able to bargain also on the international level. Bargaining is the goal and the task of the union -- no bargaining, no union.
Our counterpart, the transnational companies, have a great deal of power and are able to bypass the law in some countries. They are violating trade union and human rights, often with government complicity. The IMF has great potential because we have unions in so many countries which we are able to link up in order to check the behaviour of multinationals in every part of the world. The main issue is to bargain with the TNCs to obtain a social code of conduct. We should establish a system in order to check their behaviour by obtaining information from trade unions in all countries where the company operates. Then we have a tool to ensure that in every country this code of conduct is respected and are able to attack them on their image. They are spending a lot of resources in order to protect their image and reputation.
Q: Could you describe how you would like to use this information?
A: The IMF can make known the behaviour of the TNCs, their violations of human and trade union rights. This is a powerful weapon if we learn to use it. My idea is that the IMF every year could publish a white paper with the documentation of companies' good and bad behaviour. This should also be published on the Internet. We could start with some companies, here in Italy for instance Fiat/General Motors, the space enterprise Alenia and the multinational SKF. Thereafter, we can step by step enlarge the number of companies. We are looking for a list of all the multinationals which have their headquarters here in Italy.
A YEARLY TRADE UNION ACTION DAY
Q: You have also proposed a trade union action day. What is that?
A: My third idea is that we, as unions, could organise a worldwide action day to protest against what the TNCs have done to violate trade union rights, human rights and the environment. At the entrance of all metalworking factories in the world, there should be a flag or a poster in order to show that unions are fighting for fair goals.
Q: How have your proposals been received by other metalworkers' unions?
A: I feel that we have the wind in our back. The three unions in Italy share this view. And we have got a good reaction, especially for the action day, from unions in North and Latin America, South Africa and Asia. In Europe, I've got support from the Nordic countries.
Q: And how do you think all these ideas would affect the IMF?
A: There has been a good discussion in the IMF. There is a lot of will and many people want to transform a good discussion into good action. The IMF has to transform from coordination to bargaining on international issues, such as social clauses, labour rights and so on. But not on wages and other national issues, not for the moment at least.
BERLUSCONI'S RETURN TO POWER
Q: You have recently got a new right-wing government with Silvio Berlusconi as prime minister. How will his return to power affect the Italian trade unions?
A: I'm very worried because during the election campaign his programme was similar to Margaret Thatcher's experiences in the UK. It is also, to a great extent, the same programme as that of the Italian employers' association. But as always, the trade unions will judge the government by its actions.
Q: Berlusconi's first period as prime minister ended in failure, and he had to leave after six months. Do you think the same thing will happen now?
A: No. He has a large majority in the parliament so will probably last for five years to the next election.
Q: The Italian metalworkers conducted a national strike action on May 18. Do you think it was successful?
A: In the negotiations for a new collective agreement, the three metalworkers' unions have demanded an increase in wages to cover inflation for the last two years, but the employers have offered a wage increase which is lower than the real inflation. 1.5 million workers are involved in the agreement and 80 per cent took part in the strike, which means more than a million workers.
Q: Are you surprised so many took part in this action?
A: Yes, I was not sure that we would be able to involve the young workers. But they came out with the older workers. That was a good surprise and gives hope for the future. In spite of Berlusconi.
The spring sun is shining from a blue sky on the huge balcony outside Giorgio Caprioli's office. It is situated on the top floor of the building belonging to the Italian metalworkers' unions, at Corso Trieste in the northeastern part of Rome, with a wonderful view over the eternal city. Caprioli is the leader of the second biggest one. With its Christian (Catholic) history, culture and traditions, it is natural that its headquarters is at the top, closest to heaven.
Caprioli has an academic background with a degree in political science, specialised in economics and sociology. He says that early on he had a dream to work with the trade unions and in 1978 one of the three confederations in Italy, the CISL (Confederazione Italiana Sindicati Lavoratori, the Italian Confederation of Workers' Trade Unions), was looking for an expert in training in his native town of Bergamo. Caprioli became that expert and his dream was realised. After four years, he moved to Milan, the regional centre of Lombardy and Italy's second biggest city, and to the metalworkers' union FIM, an affiliate of the CISL. Ten years later, in 1992, he became a secretary at the FIM headquarters in Rome, responsible for the steel industry, organising issues, bargaining and work organisation.
Since 1998, Giorgio Caprioli is the general secretary of the FIM. He also represents the three Italian metalworkers' federations on the IMF's Executive Committee.
The Italian trade union movement is divided into three confederations, and the metalworkers' unions as well (see the fact box below). Several attempts have been made to unify them but without success. 1969 marked the beginning of the first structural attempt at unification. In 1972, these efforts led to the foundation of the Unitarian CGIL, CISL and UIL Federation, a transitional compromise solution that hopefully should have been followed, in a second stage, by full organic integration. However, this second stage never materialised.
SITTING IN THE SAME BUILDING
Q: The three unions are already sitting in the same building. When do you think the next attempt will be made to unify them?
A: At the present time, it is difficult to forecast another date for a possible unification. There are different reasons. The first is what kind of connections the unions have with politics. The CGIL has chosen to have a main connection with the parties on the left, a model which is typical also for the Nordic countries. Left means the Democratic Left (Democratici di Sinistra, the former Communist Party). It is not an institutional connection but more a political, psychological and cultural one. The CISL, to which the FIM is affiliated, has by tradition the idea that the union has a great and deep autonomy to the government and the political parties. We have a lot of opinions within the union, and it is the same for the UIL. Another reason is regarding the content of union actions, especially in bargaining. The CISL thinks it is necessary to give more power at local level. Italy is a country with big differences between the regions and between enterprises. Decentralised bargaining is more able to keep the specifics of the local situation. The CGIL is more in favour of centralised bargaining A third reason is how the unions react to the changes in the economy and in the society. The FIM thinks that the task of the union is to bargain to influence the direction in which the changes are going. The FIOM has more the idea to organise resistance against the changes.
NATIONAL AGREEMENTS ARE IMPERATIVE
Q: Do you mean that they are more conservative than your union?
A: In some way, yes. It's a paradox. Thinking by tradition, being to the left is to be more innovative, but it's not the case in Italy. We have some people to the left who are not innovative. If you are conservative or progressive depends on the way the union faces changes in the society.
Q: How important is it for the trade unions to resist employers' attempts to dismantle the national collective agreements?
A: Very important. Although the FIM believes that we have to give more power to decentralised bargaining, we think that national agreements are imperative. We want to maintain them. The national agreement is the tool that guarantees all workers a minimum of rights. It is especially important for the workers in small enterprises which have only the national bargaining. It's a sort of solidarity.
Q: Where are Italian trade unions the strongest, at local or central level?
A: It's an equilibrium between the centre and the periphery, but a great majority of the activists are in the workplaces -- 10,000 of our 190,000 members. We have 350 fulltime officials. Twenty-five are here in the headquarters; all the others are in the regions or at the local level. It is about the same in the other unions.
INCREASED VISIBILITY ON THE POLITICAL STAGE
Q: The trade unions in Europe are in decline, according to a new report from the European Trade Union Institute, based in Brussels, Belgium. In Italy, the proportion of the workforce in trade unions has decreased, from 49 per cent in 1980 to 38 per cent today. How do you explain this?
A: There are three reasons. Firstly, it was the price we had to pay for the policy of responsibility. The unions made an agreement with the government concerning pension and wage increases that was not popular. Secondly, the number of workers has decreased in the big companies such as in the steel and car industry, where the unions usually have been strong, and increased in the small business enterprises, where it is difficult to organise. Thirdly, we have our traditional difficulty to organise what is now an increasing number of white-collar workers and technicians. Here, we have a common problem with the other unions in Europe.
Q: The same report says that the unions have increased their role of visibility on the political stage. Especially after 1996, when the centre-left Prodi government took office, the trade unions have indubitably increased their influence. "But," says the report, "this greater political influence has raised new problems, above all in relations with the rank and file."
A: Yes, this is one of the negative consequences of having too much centralisation. In the last 10 years this centralisation was necessary in order to heal the country's economy. The unions made some important general agreements about the economy to fight against inflation. But today, the healing of the economy has been realised and we need to give more power to the rank and file.
Q: In an interview given to the Italian newspaper La Republica, the American economist and Nobel Prize winner Paul Samuelson has praised the Italian trade unions for their role in the modernisation of the society. "For years you (Italy) have been walking along a razor's edge, and the unions could have given you the fatal push. They didn't do so. Perhaps you don't realise it, but the unions are the jewel in your crown."
A: I agree with Paul Samuelson (big laugh). Otherwise we would have had an economic catastrophe.
NO BARGAINING, NO UNION
Q: You have raised the issue of benchmarking the transnational companies (TNCs) within the International Metalworkers' Federation. How would you like to realise this idea?
A: The fundamental proposal is that the trade union must be able to bargain also on the international level. Bargaining is the goal and the task of the union -- no bargaining, no union.
Our counterpart, the transnational companies, have a great deal of power and are able to bypass the law in some countries. They are violating trade union and human rights, often with government complicity. The IMF has great potential because we have unions in so many countries which we are able to link up in order to check the behaviour of multinationals in every part of the world. The main issue is to bargain with the TNCs to obtain a social code of conduct. We should establish a system in order to check their behaviour by obtaining information from trade unions in all countries where the company operates. Then we have a tool to ensure that in every country this code of conduct is respected and are able to attack them on their image. They are spending a lot of resources in order to protect their image and reputation.
Q: Could you describe how you would like to use this information?
A: The IMF can make known the behaviour of the TNCs, their violations of human and trade union rights. This is a powerful weapon if we learn to use it. My idea is that the IMF every year could publish a white paper with the documentation of companies' good and bad behaviour. This should also be published on the Internet. We could start with some companies, here in Italy for instance Fiat/General Motors, the space enterprise Alenia and the multinational SKF. Thereafter, we can step by step enlarge the number of companies. We are looking for a list of all the multinationals which have their headquarters here in Italy.
A YEARLY TRADE UNION ACTION DAY
Q: You have also proposed a trade union action day. What is that?
A: My third idea is that we, as unions, could organise a worldwide action day to protest against what the TNCs have done to violate trade union rights, human rights and the environment. At the entrance of all metalworking factories in the world, there should be a flag or a poster in order to show that unions are fighting for fair goals.
Q: How have your proposals been received by other metalworkers' unions?
A: I feel that we have the wind in our back. The three unions in Italy share this view. And we have got a good reaction, especially for the action day, from unions in North and Latin America, South Africa and Asia. In Europe, I've got support from the Nordic countries.
Q: And how do you think all these ideas would affect the IMF?
A: There has been a good discussion in the IMF. There is a lot of will and many people want to transform a good discussion into good action. The IMF has to transform from coordination to bargaining on international issues, such as social clauses, labour rights and so on. But not on wages and other national issues, not for the moment at least.
BERLUSCONI'S RETURN TO POWER
Q: You have recently got a new right-wing government with Silvio Berlusconi as prime minister. How will his return to power affect the Italian trade unions?
A: I'm very worried because during the election campaign his programme was similar to Margaret Thatcher's experiences in the UK. It is also, to a great extent, the same programme as that of the Italian employers' association. But as always, the trade unions will judge the government by its actions.
Q: Berlusconi's first period as prime minister ended in failure, and he had to leave after six months. Do you think the same thing will happen now?
A: No. He has a large majority in the parliament so will probably last for five years to the next election.
Q: The Italian metalworkers conducted a national strike action on May 18. Do you think it was successful?
A: In the negotiations for a new collective agreement, the three metalworkers' unions have demanded an increase in wages to cover inflation for the last two years, but the employers have offered a wage increase which is lower than the real inflation. 1.5 million workers are involved in the agreement and 80 per cent took part in the strike, which means more than a million workers.
Q: Are you surprised so many took part in this action?
A: Yes, I was not sure that we would be able to involve the young workers. But they came out with the older workers. That was a good surprise and gives hope for the future. In spite of Berlusconi.